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Ms Holmes Lit Comp 9 OHS


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Debate Score:417
Arguments:175
Total Votes:489
Ended:02/02/15
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 Does the United States have a "class system"? (139)

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Does the United States have a "class system"?

Respond to this question with a clear position statement. Give a reason or reasons for your position. Below are some questions to get you started thinking about the issues involved--they are FAR from the only questions/issues that this topic might raise, and are only intended to get the conversation rolling. =) Remember to visit ProCon.org to gather evidence for your position as the debate gathers steam, and to CITE the source of ALL evidence, wherever it comes from! Also remember to observe the rules of a classroom discussion--keep it civil!


What is "The American Dream"? How easy is it for someone born into poverty in the US to work his or her way out of poverty? What are the statistics versus what people say they believe when they answer opinion polls? What do social scientists tell us about "class mobility" (the ability of Americans to move from one social class to another)? What does social science tell us that people believe about their own success in life? What are the facts about how the majority of very wealthy people became very wealthy? What is a "rags to riches story"? Who are some people in the US who are examples of this kind of story? What are the facts about how your parents' level of education influences your life outcomes? Does this always have to be true? Who are Jaime Escalante, Rafe Esquith, and Ron Clark? How do popular culture and media portray people of various class levels? Who are the target audiences for these various messages? Just because something is shown a certain way on tv, does that mean it's true? What does it mean to say that a thing is "ghetto"--is that an insult based on race, class, or both? Why do most middle- and upper-middle-class people think that this is an acceptable thing to say?  Are students with obviously cheap, poorly-fitting clothing, and other clear markers of poverty regularly accepted into groups of upper-middle-class and wealthy students at OHS? Is the educational system biased in favor of certain classes? Is the justice system? What are the financial and social backgrounds of the majority of the people in our Congress? In the past ten years, what is the Congress's record when it comes to passing legislation that will help the poor? The middle class? the wealthy? What do the majority of economists say about the Congress's record of helping these various groups? Is Congress's voting record evidence of our cultural beliefs or evidence of something else?

 

 

Add New Argument
14 points

I think, the class system exists, and should be weakened or removed. No one in poverty can make a change for our country, and we need every American citizen to join hands with each other to strengthen not only our government, or our economy, but for us to join as one; one nation. This is what we need and without this, we will not be able to get where other countries are. We will not be able to achieve excellence. We will just worry about making a ceiling for being rich, and a floor for being poor, but that is not what our country needs to worry about. We can’t deal with one problem, because we have one-hundred and one to deal with.

-Deniz Kalfa 1/26/15

adallas7(27) Disputed
7 points

But if people work hard for their money then they should get the benefits.

nickw(15) Disputed
6 points

People who work hard in life should be rewarded. What I got from your argument was that everyone should have equal pay. Maybe I misinterpreted it, but that can't happen because there is no motive to work.

nathanto(23) Disputed
4 points

I strongly disagree with your statement. Yes people who work hard should be rewarded, but what about the other people who have worked so hard and still their reward is grass for their blanket and the sidewalk for their beds. Sometimes Life could just have negative affects on hard-working individuals who really deserve the reward.

adairj18(9) Clarified
3 points

I agree with Jelly and Nick. If we didn't have a class system then no one would be motivated to work. Yes, I think it should be weakened though; giving more to the poor.

NoahB(30) Disputed
5 points

You're definitely right about our economic classes, and it's unfortunate that this great divide exists. However, I don't necessarily think removing economic classes will make us "join hands" and to become more unified in general. This is where equality comes in; if our nation is built on the premise of everyone being equal, we can't rank people by their wealth. What we need to do is focus less on money and accept that there are so many different factors in play, so many differences among the poor, and the rich, and everyone in between. We need to understand that every person is so different from everyone else that ranking them is silly and detrimental to equality.

adallas7(27) Disputed
5 points

How would we weaken or remove the class system? Why would one work hard for their money then give it away to someone who doesn't work hard?

alainamarr(3) Disputed
5 points

You're wrong. I don't support your statement. This is all just statistics and nothing relevant for young teenagers to help support our world. Also, you don't have any evidence and you could be crazy and psycho.

LathamV(14) Disputed
4 points

Not to be disrespectful to any other countries, but which ones are already the excellent ones? Maybe you could name a few. That's all I would like to know. How can we receive higher excellence than which countries?

kalfad18(12) Disputed
1 point

China? They have one of the greatest empires alive today. The Soviet Union? They were more successful than America at that time. I'm not supporting Communism, but something that would weaken the class system.

4 points

This makes a lot of sense and I agree with the fact that the class system should be removed.

4 points

I strongly agree with your statement Deniz, we need to either get rid of the class system, or better the system so everything would be fair

cloutierj18(37) Disputed
3 points

What is your evidence towards believing there is a class system? You say that there is one and you give examples as to how to fix it, but you don't back it up with evidence that there even is a class system.

3 points

I agree, but to what extent is the class system in the U.S.? Is there some evidence in statistics that can tell us what key measures to take? When you say, "We will just worry about making a ceiling..........but this is not what our country needs to worry about," what do you mean? Should we be dealing with this issue?

3 points

This is not a communistic argument there is an extensive class system in the country and I believe that it is important for people to have pretty closes wages. Because the country's "class system" is getting a little out of hand.

nickw(15) Disputed
2 points

You say you want equal wages but that can't work. If everyone is being paid the same, or even about the same, there would be no reason to get a good education and job. Some jobs are harder and need more time put into them, so if it were equal pay there would be no reason to get a good job. Everyone would just get an easy job because at the end of the day you would be making the same amount of money as everyone else. It be like paying someone at a job that takes little to none education the same amount as some one who spent years of their life learning how to succeed at there job. It would not work.

2 points

I totaly agree with you, everybody should have close to the same amount of money, or just get rid of it because it's causing a havoc for a lot of people, unfortunately.

3 points

I previously said that the class system should be weakened, and I still stand by what I said, but I also do believe that at the end of the day, hard working people should see their benefits. One new piece of my opinion that I am adding is education. Many people are not able to get to get equal education, and this is one of the reasons. In 1995, 88.3% of U.S. students were in public schools, and 11.7% were in private schools. In 2009, 90.0% of U.S. students were in public schools, and 10.0% were in private schools. It is projected that in 2021 there will be 90.9% of U.S. students in public schools, and 9.1% in private schools. I think that after you have completed education, it does not make sense for equality in jobs so that people do see their benefits. I don't support communism, I support equal chances.

Supporting Evidence: Proportion of U.S. Students in Public Schools vs. Private Schools (www.huffingtonpost.com)
1 point

Weakened is the key word not removed, that is what changed my opinion on your argument.

3 points

I don't think Deniz is trying to say everyone has equal pay but that it is increasingly hard to rise to the top in are country when a lot of us are poor.

1 point

The "class system", is not something artificial in our society, it's natural. There is nothing we can actually do that will help more than it will hurt to the economy that will fix the class system. If we give equal pay, people with harder jobs will protest, and if you only pay those that are working at a certain level of difficulty, you have the whole lower class and half of the middle class protesting for their "equal treatment. The only thing that I believe we can do to actually help this condition, is to just ignore this factor. I don't mean ignorance, but keeping it like a control variable in science. If we do this, many people will forget about the class system because, well, everyone else has.

-Deniz Kalfa 1/29/15

sibelm(9) Clarified
1 point

I don't think there is a way for it to be removed, but there might be a way to weaken it. I agree that we need every American citizen to get together to achieve this.

adallas7(27) Disputed
1 point

Deniz,

People in poverty can make a change for our country! Don't underestimate them!!! The link down below shows a homeless man risking his life for a stranger. This has sent a message to our country to make a change and sometimes put others before ourselves. So there you go Deniz, a man in poverty made a difference.

Supporting Evidence: click here for the link (www.huffingtonpost.com)
romanj(5) Disputed
1 point

I strongly disagree. We all read "Animal Farm" in 8th grade. We all know that a society without a class system would not work. it would simply fall apart, and most likely one person would come back to the top. I do believe, however, that the class system should be reduced to a lesser standing.

romanj(5) Disputed
1 point

I strongly disagree. We all read "Animal Farm" in 8th grade. We all know that a society without a class system would not work. it would simply fall apart, and most likely one person would come back to the top. I do believe, however, that the class system should be reduced to a lesser standing.

1 point

The reason that the class system is active, is because some people don't get chances to rise up in the class system, or it's just that many people work hard and get to the top. This is just the way things are, and the people that don't work hard don't deserve the right to protest, but I believe that the people that don't have a chance do deserve a chance.

-Deniz Kalfa 1/30/15

adallas7(27) Clarified
1 point

Well if the people that "don't have a chance" don't work hard to try and "rise up in the class system" then why should they "get a chance".

kait(17) Disputed
1 point

I somewhat disagree with this......... yes I believe it should be weakened or removed but I believe that the people in poverty could try to work hard and could make a difference if they really wanted to. I also think that not everyone has to join hands as long as there is a significant amount that is fighting for the cause.

alaabairm(19) Disputed
1 point

If we didn't have a class system then the people who work really hard would have nothing to work for and the people who don't work will continue to not work, because they think they have no reason to.

11 points

America used to be very separate, we have came a long way. The wealthy were always chosen to be in big business/government, instead of the middle/poor. I don't believe it is as segregated as it used to be, but people are very greedy now a days. They don't donate to charities as much, It is better than before, but think of how many homeless people have starved to death... We will always need improvement on helping others. America need to become more equal and less leaning towards the rich. We should donate more. We need to help others to become more equal. Everyone should become middle class, so America would be equal.

5 points

I agree we should all be equal instead of being classified on how much money we earn

4 points

I agree that we have been way too greedy. We should be donating more and helping others.

AnjiniC(40) Clarified
4 points

I certainly agree that we should do all we can to create a solid "middle class", especially donating. This will make life more comfortable for a lot of people. However, a single class society would mean that all citizens earn roughly the same amount per year. What would happen to the different types of jobs? How would our economy react?

2 points

Well we shouldn't be placed in classes. America doesn't have to be completely equal but I do believe that we should help others, by donating to local causes. This will strengthen America as a whole too.

3 points

I agree that we should work on creating a smaller gap between the rich and the poor

3 points

Social class has always been know as if you were rich/poor. There shouldn't be such a big gap, some people make $1,000 dollars in a full time job... and others make millions. Now some people have made bad desiccation, and karma has came back to them. But what about the innocent ones? They could have been born into a poor family, faced bills, medical insurance, losing job & etc. We should help the ones in need, so then we will no longer need "social classes." We could become equal! Now I am not saying that everyone needs to be rich... some people work there butts off to pay for there house/family.

Supporting Evidence: What is a social class? (udel.edu)
3 points

I agree with Destiny since people that are rich do not look at other classes.

3 points

You say: "We will always need improvement on helping others. America needs to become more equal and less leaning towards the rich." This is quite like my point about the class system being perception. Our class system just makes the rich more powerful than the poor, and believing in the "Upper Class" just makes the situation better for them and worse for you, no matter how wealthy you actually are.

3 points

I really like how you pointed this out. We really need to acknowledge that although we may have it good, there are still lots of people suffering. The US may be a leading country, but there are still some people in poverty.

Tallurid18(27) Disputed
2 points

Not to disagree with you but according to these stats most corporate accounts donate almost 5-10% of their owning. Bill Gates donates a lot of his money to charity so I have to disagree with you that rich don't donate to charities because they donate more than any other social class.

Supporting Evidence: Charity (www.charitynavigator.org)
Destiny-A(26) Disputed
3 points

But that is one person...what about half of the people that live in okemos???

adairj18(9) Disputed
2 points

So, are you going with that there is a social class? And when you said you think people are more greedy that is just an opinion. You don't have any evidence to support your statement.

2 points

You are correct this argument was completely opinionated and had no evidence

Destiny-A(26) Disputed
1 point

There is my information on how greedy america is now a days...My other evidence is the NEWS...

Supporting Evidence: Greedy with money (www.zerohedge.com)
nickw(15) Disputed
2 points

The wealthy weren't always chosen to be in bigness. what it comes down to is people want a good leader of their country, generally that means someone who has an education and experience. These people tend to be richer because they have put time, work, and energy into their life to improve it. Also people don't have to donate to charities, it may be the good thing to do but what it comes down to is they worked hard for their money, why should they have to give it away if they don''t want to. That being said, it would be nice if they donated, it just doesn't mean they must do it.

Destiny-A(26) Disputed
2 points

You don't need tons of money to have an education... Most people that are in the lower/middle class work their butts off to get what they want. For most rich people they get most of their stuff handed to them on a sliver platter. (In other sense, some higher class people don't work for what they want, there parents just give it to them... a lot of richer people haven't worked a day in their life.)

nickw(15) Clarified
2 points

I meant big business and leaders at the beginning of my argument

11 points

For those people saying a class system shouldn't exist, imagine life without one. For example if you have ever read the Giver. Everyone is equal but it the end it doesn't work.

A woman wrote this article about what would happen if everyone had the same amount of money.

"If everyone was given the same amount of money, it would not solve the problem of how people manage it. The parable of the talents in Bible is a passage to reference (Mat 25:14-30), in that it shows there are those who manage money well, even make it grow and others who don't. There are investors and there are squanders. Those who squander will beg, borrow and steal to have an 'equal' or 'better' lifestyle than those who manage money well, living a conservative and consistent lifestyle. There are people who work to earn money and pay their bills and taxes. There are people who don't work and live off the taxes of those who do, etc. So, if everyone started out with the same amount of wealth, they would not end up where they started ~ some would have more, some the same and some far less or without. "

Find it here: http://flobe.hubpages.com/question/88027/how-would-this-world-be-different-if-everyone-was-equally-wealthy

adairj18(9) Clarified
4 points

I totally agree; I think you have to have a class system even if it is very "low key."

1 point

I agree with you that there should be a class system and that everyone shouldn't be the same. However I do think the disparity between the rich and poor shouldn't be as high, that's all.

10 points

The United States has a class system for sure. Although we have come a long way from being discriminating, there is still some evidence to the segregation between different classes of people. They make these classes based on wealth and education among other things. Even scientists agree there is some evidence to these classes.

Supporting Evidence: The Class Structure in the U.S. (www.boundless.com)
cloutierj18(37) Disputed
3 points

Also, if they weren't social classes, then how would we get the stereotypes of a dirty homeless man or a snobby rich man? They wouldn't exist unless there was a form of separation as to how we are grouped.

4 points

I feel like this stereotyping and the general stigma about being rich or poor is why we believe there's a class system. For everyone's benefit, we should try to see everyone in the same light to even the playing field, which would eliminate the classes we see, proving they're actually there.

AnjiniC(40) Disputed
4 points

Do we need these stereotypes that form the class system? If not, our society could become like the one in . If so, could we make the system less harsh in some way?

cloutierj18(37) Clarified
1 point

Also colleges take a liking a richer people because then they don't have to offer scholarships since the people can pay for themselves. Thus he rich get better education creating a bigger gap.

10 points

I believe that the U.S. has a class system, based on wealth, education, and occupation. There isn't as much poverty as there used to be, and a large 40% of the U.S. are categorized under the middle class.

Supporting Evidence: The Class Structure in the U.S. (www.boundless.com)
3 points

Yes, I totally agree with this statement. I also agree that 40% of the US are under the middle class based on observations.

3 points

I agree it's based on wealth, education, and occupation. Do you think the 40% can increase or decrease?

7 points

Although the United States has taken many measures to ensure the equality of its citizens, there is still a noticeable gap between the incomes of people. This discrepancy is responsible for a class system within the U.S., which, in turn, can permanently affect Americans’ lifestyles. For instance, families with more money can afford to invest lavishly in their children’s education, whether it be mandolin lessons, Mandarin, or golf. As a result, these children are more likely to be successful in school. In addition, colleges tend to accept applicants who come from wealthy backgrounds, knowing that they can pay full tuition, and possibly donate. This makes it difficult for children from lower income families to rise to high paying positions.

cloutierj18(37) Disputed
4 points

I agree with when you say that people coming from rich families get more money, but I believe that there are some programs where the poor can get scholarships to college. What makes them at such a disadvantage in terms of college when compared to the rich students?

AnjiniC(40) Clarified
2 points

Colleges may have a preference for students who can pay; they do not always to give up money.

3 points

I agree, I think its harder now then it used to be poor and then climb the ladder to high paying jobs.

2 points

The evidence for the argument above came from a magazine called .

There is definitely a class system in the U.S., otherwise people would be leading fairly similar lifestyles with similar incomes. While the system is quite harmful to people, it also seems to be closely entwined with the economy. Is there some way to reduce the harshness of the system, while making life more comfortable for people and supporting the economy? If the economy is damaged, there will be one class in the U.S.: poverty.

AnjiniC(40) Clarified
2 points

The name of the magazine did not come through; it is The Economist.

1 point

I think that the types of jobs people have indicate the presence of a class system. For example, a number of people in the U.S. clean houses and take out trash. As a result, they do not earn as much money as a doctor or teacher. This forces them to live in poor conditions.

Supporting Evidence: 8 lowest paying jobs (www.nbcnews.com)
1 point

While few people earn minimum wages, many earn just enough to support themselves with low paying jobs. There are also a number of teenagers in low paying jobs. While some teenagers do this to earn money on the side, others work in low paying jobs for a living. This contributes to poverty, which, in turn, contributes to a lower class.

Supporting Evidence: Who makes minimum wages? (www.pewresearch.org)
7 points

"Class system" is a broad, tricky concept. It takes into account someone's social, economic, academic, and just their entire identity in general. Taking that into account, the citizens of the United States have diverse identities, so cut-and-dried "classes" can't really exist, but that doesn't mean there aren't certain groups who have their identities influenced by their family, friends, and community. Because of this and the way we tend to lump together a group of people with the same characteristics, a class system seem to exist. We're more or less just looking at the similar parts of a group's identities, and not seeing the differences that create diversity among otherwise similar people. Because there are so many factors going into determining it, the existence of an American "class system" is ultimately an issue of perception. But due to our perception, many of us see a class system, even if it does not exist.

NoahB(30) Clarified
4 points

If you use wealth as the only way define someone's social class, we obviously have a class system. However, we're really just blindly grouping people together. Because of how diverse our country is, we can't really perceive classes by wealth alone. Does person A, who is one "wealth-class" below person B but is happier and leads a better life, belong below that person in any ranking?

4 points

I like the way you think. I agree with you that most peoples' vision is clouded by money alone and that people are really just grouped by other people, and even each other, by how much money one has. Maybe by assuming from how nice a house they have if one would just throw out "you're rich!" rather than just simply "nice house" and respect the fact that that one person is friends with the other person. Like you said, it is an issue of perception.

NoahB(30) Clarified
2 points

What I'm beginning to see now from the differences among my argument versus everyone else is that our class system is mostly an illusion. Even though we have gaps between "the rich," "the middle class," and "the poor," the reason the poor suffer and the rich prosper, and the reason reforming these separate groups is so hard, lies in the fact that once you make a certain amount of money, you believe you are happy. Once you're rich, you become happy, and once you're poor, you're unhappy. We need to remove the mental block of wealth equals happiness in order to have equality among people of different incomes, and remove the image of money separating us all.

AnjiniC(40) Clarified
2 points

I understand what you are saying. However, social, economic, and academic status all seem to be related, and there is a definite difference between families that earn more and families who live on low wages. The social status of low income families is generally lower than that of high income families. The academic status of low income families is also generally lower than high income families (with the exception of "rags to riches" stories). This academic status ultimately affects social status (professors, for instance, are usually respected). Is there a class system? I think there is a definite monetary gap between the rich and the poor that is not an issue of perception and that affects other identities.

AnjiniC(40) Clarified
2 points

What steps could we take to remove the mental block of wealth?

NoahB(30) Clarified
2 points

Income gaps and the resulting social gaps are true facts and not issues of our perception. The issue with these facts are how we apply the facts. Just because there are these gaps between us, why should we let them divide us and change our identities?

As you said, these monetary gaps are affecting our identities through our social, economic, and academic status. However, those statuses are not tied to income alone. Who we are is not what we earn, and we are creating a situation where our identity is that way? Even though how rich or poor you are affects other things, it doesn't change who you are.

6 points

I think that in the US there is separate classes. You have the upper class, the middle class, the working class, and then you have the poor. The ranges are from being able to buy anything you need and want to not being able to afford to buy yourself a meal. Some people earn their way up to being upper class and some inherit loads of money. Others just get a steady job earning enough to get through and have a little extra to play with. Then you have the poor who cant get enough to make it through or barley make it with little to no money extra.

2 points

I think that we should figure out a way to make the classes a bit more close, and try to eliminate the poor by creating more jobs for people to do and offering more pay.

1 point

By Reducing the amount of the poor, we as a country would be stronger, everyone could support themselves and not rely on other people to support them. But making less poor would mean we would need to create more jobs for those people to work.

6 points

The U.S. does not have a defined class system, but it is obvious that the likelihood of someone who is born into poverty rising to riches is not as great as the likelihood of someone who is born wealthy. There are some people who have defied the social boundaries and rose from "rags to riches." One example of this is Andrew Carnegie. He was born into a poor family in Scotland, where they struggled to survive. It wasn't until they moved to the U.S. that Carnegie started to make a name for himself by working in factories and as a messenger boy. He eventually became the owner of the largest steel company in America

Supporting Evidence: Andrew Carnegie (www.history.com)
4 points

A recent poll shows that 49% of american babies born poor will remain poor throughout their lifetime. This is because of the social and economic barriers that our society puts in their way. They don't have the money and resources to advance in the world.

Supporting Evidence: Born Poor (www.urban.org)
2 points

I think that the "class system" in America is very uneven, and that we should work to shorten the gap between the wealthy and the poor. But at the same time I feel like getting rid of the class system altogether wouldn't be good because then people would have nothing to work for.

2 points

This is a GREAT argument! I 100% agree with your statement. PS, Andrew Carnegie is a great example of the social class.

1 point

I think people who experience "rags to riches" transformations are people who see society as it is, and are not blinded by the "class system." If you're born into poverty, you're not going to get out if you don't believe you can do great things, even if you don't have privileges that make doing great things easier.

6 points

Yes, there are at least four classes; upper, lower, middle, working ect.... People can be put into a class by two ways, objective or subjective. Objective is when you use certain criteria such as occupation, education, or income. With objective, the author is decides which social class you are in. With subjective you would ask the people what class they think they are in. One of the biggest effects on where people are placed is how far they went in school. Statistics show that people who have a college degree end up making a higher yearly wage. There are social classes in america but it does not mean that people live by them.

nickw(15) Clarified
2 points

class systems are hard to create and can be created in many different ways, but they do exist.

NoahB(30) Clarified
1 point

Your argument is interesting. I'm trying to convince people that we're living by our class system and it doesn't exist; classifying people through those objective and subjective criteria is wrong. However, your argument isn't really saying the opposite, just that there are all these factors, but they don't matter much, and we're doing a good enough to not classify people by them.

6 points

Chloe Nedds

I believe the United States has a class system. In many ways, people are grouped by wealth, income, and education. The class system difference is not as big as it used to be, where there were many Americans in poverty, and a smaller number of Americans who were very wealthy. There are many more people now who have larger incomes who could be doing things to help shorten the gap between lower and upper class.

Supporting Evidence: American Class System (www.boundless.com)
5 points

I totally agree with your argument! There are fewer wealthy people and they could make a big difference if more were to support the poor and needy people. People definitely could be working on this gap. Wealthy people are not the only ones who can make a difference. What could the middle class do too that would shorten this gap between classes?

3 points

I totally understand what you mean by being grouped by different traits and I agree.

2 points

I agree that people are grouped by wealth and income, but I just want to know what you mean by "grouped by education".

nickw(15) Clarified
4 points

People can be classified by how far or much of an education they have gotten.

neddsc18(12) Clarified
4 points

People who have a doctorate are ranked higher in the class system because that high of a degree means you have enough money to spend on education and that you are very educated.

People who did not even go to or finish college will not be as highly ranked in the class system.

NoahB(30) Disputed
1 point

Although I agree with the fact that people with higher income aren't doing anything to close gaps in wealth, and that we're grouping people by "wealth, income, and education," I don't believe this grouping is beneficial. This grouping encourages people to feel as if they can't change their future, that they're restricted by their identity. Your identity shouldn't hurt you, it should give you challenges to overcome.

5 points

Carolyn Harron

I believe the United States has a "class system" because people who appear to be richer are "put at the top" while people who may not have much money are "put to the bottom"

Supporting Evidence: class system (www.boundless.com)
5 points

I do think the United States has a class system. They have upper class, middle class, and the lower class, upper class which is where all the big business owners, singers, tv show hosts, sports players, etc are like. The middle class is the class that are just living their life and cherish every moment to the full potential. The lower class is the class where people who made mistakes were not given another chance and were punished or were born into it. I think people shouldn't be judged for what class they are and that we should try to make it so its more equal. This could happen by people donating more money and it will balance out.

TuanH(20) Clarified
2 points

I feel like charitable groups are doing a good job in trying to help people out like the Red Cross for example they specialize in helping people out in need. However I feel like people aren't doing a good job enough in donating to the needy to help them get back on course. So last year their was a tornado in Oklahoma City and Kevin Durant a star player of Oklahoma City Thunder decide to donate 1 million dollars in money to help the people that were effected by the tornado. I saw that on tv and was very happy but wondered why it doesn't happen more often to help the homeless people in need of a place to live or food to eat.

hausere18(27) Disputed
1 point

I'm not sure if relying on people's charitable donations should be an answer to this problem. I think direct government intervention is the best way to fix it.

hausere18(27) Clarified
2 points

It is certainly great when people donate, but is not something we can rely on.

TuanH(20) Clarified
1 point

I'm not trying to say that they need to rely on it I'm just saying that it would help if people donated more.

1 point

I agree. If charity was the best solution, why hasn't this been fixed yet? why don't people have the true support they need?

LathamV(14) Disputed
1 point

I agree. If charity was the best solution, why hasn't this been fixed yet? why don't people have the true support they need?

TuanH(20) Clarified
1 point

I believe that hard working people should be paid what they earn. However I feel like people think that if you are working at Mcdonalds or Burger king you aren't working your full potential and aren't working hard. I find that to be totally wrong because people might be working at Mcdonalds or Burger king because they can't find a job and they have a family that they need to feed. If you don't have a high paying job it doesn't mean you're not working hard.

5 points

I believe that there is a class system in the United States but it is not one that we should be ashamed about. Basically there are the "rich class" the "medium class", and the "poor class" but having a class system is not a bad thing in my opinion. Everybody wants to aim for the top class, so it will force people to work hard in school and do focus to reach that goal. Not having a "class system" would mean people will not care, even the people that end up working really hard will not have a purpose. But with a "class system" we are guaranteed for people to aim high and this will strive our government to do great things.

3 points

The list of social classes in the united states, this proves there are social classes

Supporting Evidence: Social Classes (en.wikipedia.org)
3 points

I agree with you because in America most people want to get into that top class. However, there are always people struggling between every class.

3 points

The "class system" should not get out of hand. I believe that there should be one but it shouldnt get crazy. It should be enough that will make people force to work to get t wear they are but not that they are so away beyond their wildest dreams from a class

1 point

There is a reason that the United States is doing better then most countries, its because they have a class system. It gives people a purpose to do well. In countries that dont have a class system they are not doing so well because people dont really care.

5 points

I think the major goal in the class system is to lessen the difference between the rich and poor and add to our middle class. On the other hand, I still think that people that have worked hard should reap their benefits. I just feel that our economy works better when everyone has some money, but I don't think everyone should have exactly the same. If everyone has exactly the same it is basically communism an din the end communism works well in theory, but it is nearly impossible for it to work well

1 point

I don't know how we should treat the class issue, but there definitely is a class system. The fact is the dwindling middle class and larger disparity between the rich and poor is a problem for the economy and are people. I'm not saying everyone should be equal, but I don't think the income differential between the rich and poor should be as high, and we as a society should attempt to fix it.

1 point

The American Dream: That one day we might be a poor immigrant, but the next we could be the CEO of a fortune 500 company. That is one of the reasons that the rich on this country feel they earned their money and shouldn't take extra tax raises. I agree that they have the right to earn their money and it's their money,, but in the end keep it in your heart the rest of your country hard working American's who struggle to make a living and support your family.

3 points

I do not believe we have a class system here in America for the average person. Whether "average" means one is poor, homeless, in the "middle class", wealthy, etc. the only "class system" of the people would be the government. However, there are some sub-hierarchy-like things such as positions for different sports, hobbies, and what ever else that may involve some kind of hierarchy, but mainly, the hierarchy of the people of the United States, there is none. One may be born into a family with a lot of money or barely any money, but either way, it is ones' own choice in where they stand. Especially as an adult. What ever "class system" there may be, it only works with peoples' choices in life. Are you going to work hard to get through college with good grades, or, when you are in college, are you going to sit back on the couch and procrastinate and not do your homework and expect that, somehow, you’ll pull through? No. There is not a class system. No hierarchy. Only choices.

adairj18(9) Disputed
1 point

What do you call the middle class, the "poor" or lower class or the upper class or "rich" than?

LathamV(14) Clarified
2 points

I'm pretty sure middle class is just "middle class"; those who have around the average of money. The ones between the rich and the poor. Not too much money to know what to do with or spend on everything, and not too little that one can't buy what they need every day.

1 point

One could be born into a poor, penniless family, barely able to make a living, and as an adult, they are as rich as rich can be. Andrew Carnegie, for example, was born into a poor family and ended up rich, but there are some that are born to a super rich family and end up as an adult with no money or knowledge of what to do on their own. No knowledge of how to even hold a job. These are all choices we make in life. Good education, or lack of focus? Be respectful to your peers and work-mates, or be disrespectful with very little self control and get fired? These all come from the choices we make throughout life, not just as a young-adult. There is no hierarchy of the people, but there are good choices and bad ones that we make.

1 point

Other choices are choices such as love. If you are a super rich adult and you meet a nice person, but they are not as rich, you aren’t making yourself any lower or them any higher. You chose to love the person, so you help them as well because you want them to be happy. This is not a hierarchy. The present-day United States does not have a public hierarchy. It only has the people who make good choices, and those who make bad ones.

1 point

The only major hierarchy is the work hierarchy, especially in the government, but this kind of hierarchy is not one most people of America are even part of, but there is one thing the people and the government have in common; they are both a part of America, so why should one have more rights than the other? There is one law that was made that I will use as this example; the right to trial. Why would one need a trial? Maybe one committed murder or assaulted someone. Compare the “average” person with one of a “higher power”, the government. If one of each were to commit murder or assault someone, would the government member, perhaps a senator, for example, have more leeway out of the situation than the “average” person? No, of course not. They would have the same penalty. This is also the same between one with less money and a “rich” person, really just one with more money. They would have the same penalty, but, depending on the severity of the problem, one may or may not be able to be let out of prison on bail. So why would there be a “class system” if we all have the same penalty? Why can’t the government help those with less money? There’s no point in leaving those with less money to suffer and/or struggle through life.

1 point

I understand what you're saying; we are choosing to have a class system. It's good how you point out that we're putting people into groups for unrelated reasons, which is only hurting our society.

1 point

If someone with less money wants, desperately, to pursue their dream career, or knows they want a career and not just an everyday job forever, they can’t because they don’t have enough money. They could ask someone for help, but maybe that person, too, is working him/herself to the bone trying to make enough money for their own education and they can’t help you. How would you be able to get money to help pay for, not only college, but just able to afford food, drink, clothing and shelter for yourself? The only way would probably be to alternate the years you are in college, meaning every other year you go to college and the rest of the time you same as much money as you can. At the same time, you still have to keep enough money around that you can pay for the most fundamental human needs. Why do I mention this, the struggle for education and money? Because this is the reality of all life. All life in all the world. Not a class system that people think exists. In America, there is a promise for money and peace. What peace comes from lack of education and living life with no knowledge of how the world works? This may happen with those with more money. A child will be raised and have their college paid for, always have a place to go for shelter, and always have a way to easily convince people, businesses, government, etc. money, the exact thing that many people think the world, and America, revolve around, is the only thing anyone ever needs, but it’s not. We also need trust, friendship and fairness. America could do better. We could all do a lot better. Telling people the truth, being friends, not enemies, helping America have equality in every way possible. Equality in labor, education, as well as helping people with less money. Most people with more money seem to think they have more power and they mostly both frown upon and only give people with less money no more than a sideways glance. How is this America? Why is this America? Does this have to be America? Is this America’s future? It’s not even the future, it is the present, so why do we let this continue? I would say people with less money should take a stand for help and fairness and be recognized that they aren’t the poor ones. The only poor ones are the rich with their poor attitude, but I would not ask these people to fight either because they already fight so hard to take care of themselves and their families. The rich and poorer need to be balanced out. Anyone with more money should reach out and help pull anyone with less money out of the ditch. I know there are charities and such, but this isn’t enough. And it’s not just the money. Like I said, it is also the trust and friendship that those who we perceive as “rich” lack greatly. I do not believe there is a class system. I only believe there are choices people make that make a difference in their own life and in America. How dare we ignore those who struggle. This “class system” is the abstract idea of a useless hierarchy thinking that money is the only power, but it isn’t. The power only comes from the people. From our choices, trust, love and our friendship.

3 points

Yes, the United States has various social classes. These can be broken up into the Middle Class, the "rich" or Upper Class and the "poor", or Lower Class. Social classes in America are not only based upon wealth, but also upon employment, occupation and education. A recent Pew study showed that there was no longer just one Middle Class, but four different ones today due to the fact that some families are unstable and can easily move from one group to another. At the top of this Middle Class group is called the Top of the Class, were those that were predominantly male, well-educated and financially secure. These people had an optimistic view of the future and are made up of nearly eighteen percent of the people. At the other end of this segment is the Struggling Middle, this group is made up of mainly women and monitors. This group has more in common with the Lower Class than the other groups in the Middle Class. This group is one paycheck away from joining the Lower Class, or poor. Unfortunately, in the last six years, household income has fallen in the United States. The recession has had a particularly severe impact on the Middle and Lower classes. Since these groups have lower incomes, any decline can be particularly hard hitting (there is little room for a loss in available money, since such a high percentage of income has to be spent on necessities like food, clothing, shelter and transportation). Social classes can be seen in nearly every country (except the most impoverished), but the opportunity for advancement is greatest in the United States. No matter your sex, color or beliefs, you still have the opportunity to work hard and to improve your standing (unlike in some other countries where certain segments of society are restricted from moving to the top of the social economic rung).

3 points

Even though the United States government has done tons of effort and legislation there is still a noticeable class difference. I feel there is certainly an upper class and a lower class, and a diminishing middle class. In my opinion the middle class is key to distributing wealth more.when you do not When there is a huge disparity between the rich and poor it leads to economic issues. For example it was a major contributor to the Great Depression. All in all, I feel that there is still work to be done to make the margin not as large.

3 points

I don't know if the U.S has an official class system or not. I believe that the U.S does have one because people are quick to judge that someone is wealthy, poor, or middle class. I also would say that the government seems to treat the people of the community like there are different classes. For example homeless people or very poor people can go to the government and ask for food stamps or help getting back on their feet. Another example when you are applying to college, some people get financial aid or take out several loans to help them pay off school. People who make a fairly nice amount of money but still don't have enough money cannot get financial aid. They only allow people who are "poor" to get help. There are several other ways that the government separates it's people based on how much money you make and how you have.

2 points

There six social classes. They are upper-upper class (1% of the U.S. population) and the lower-upper class (2%), upper-middle class (14%), the lower-middle class (26%), working poor (13%, and underclass (14%). This model of all the social classes is an example that a lot of people believe there are a class system.

Supporting Evidence: Social Class Model (www.boundless.com)
2 points

The more people who drop out of high school are the majority from the lower class because they cannot afford a college education and also don't have the money to try and improve their learning skills. Fewer dropouts are middle class and even fewer are the rich kids.

Supporting Evidence: Charts of Social Classes (www.alternet.org)
1 point

This article supports my idea that there is a class system. It states that "class now determines Americans' fates." It also gives a common simple example of how bad the class system was and still can be......... If your daddy was rich, you're gonna stay rich, and if your daddy was poor, you're gonna stay poor. In some ways that example is still true but people that are poor wouldn't except the fact that they are so they try to work their way up the social class ladder. Some become very success and others not so much.

Supporting Evidence: American Class System (www.esquire.com)
3 points

I think that by having a class system, not everyone's voices are heard, and it ruins the legacy of life in this nation and people's pursuit of happiness.

Supporting Evidence: Why Does Class Matter? (www.classism.org)
1 point

I totally agree with this!!! It does ruin people's happiness because the lower class start to lose hope that things could ever get better and everyone deserves a fair chance in life.

2 points

I think that the U.S does have a class system which is upper, middle, and lower. Some people might disagree with it but that might be because no one wants to admit it because it's not really a thing for everyone.

aubreet(5) Clarified
2 points

i agree with you 100%. Most of the time people are born into these "classes"

kait(17) Clarified
1 point

Do you believe that there are places in between each class where people could qualify?

sibelm(9) Clarified
1 point

Yes, there are people who can be between upper and middle class, and there can be people between middle and lower class.

2 points

I think that we do have a class system because we don't have much poverty and most of us are in the middle class and we have kind of a great economy.

2 points

When someone is born into poverty their lives begin difficult. When a family makes very little money it pressures them because of all the payments they have to make. For the richer class on the other hand it is much easier to make payments and have good lives. People of the middle and upper class make fun of the lower class by saying things are for example ghetto. And to make it harder on the lower class, congress raised taxes on the people in poverty and lowered the taxes on the middle and upper class.

adallas7(27) Clarified
3 points

Nick,

Not everyone makes fun of people in the lower class, you can't forget about the people who donate their time and money to help this class. You can't make assumptions.

2 points

Yes, the U.S. does have a class system. All over the news you here upper, middle, and lower classes. Although most americans are in the middle class, we still have people in the upper and lower classes.

1 point

I think that the middle class is the most efficient class, because they help the distribution of wealth.

2 points

In the U.S. we do have a class system. Though it may not be close in terms of money, it does show who works hard and who is just average. For example, the 1st class people worked hard to get money and the 3rd class are people who don't really have a good education and can't earn as much money.

2 points

I believe that equality is not completely prominent in american culture. I, myself have experienced this firsthand. I have been thought of as "poor" and "worthless" by upper class levels. This was prominently because of my "raggamuffin" look. People can't seem to comprehend how some people may have money, but choose to look a certain way. I don't personally have much money, which also leans into the idea that i am a whelp to the upper class. What people in the upper class don't seem to recognise is that life isn't dependant on how much money any one person has, it depends on their heart.

1 point

I agree completely. A lot of people with money can be way too cocky and strut around like everyone else is inferior, while people with less money usually have the better judgment and better hearts. People with less money also tend to have more empathy and sympathy for many people, while people with more money may have mostly apathy for others.

2 points

I don't mind the fact that people are helping those in need so that the classes are more even, but there are also people that have dug this hole for themselves. As much as I hate to see people suffer they need to learn a lesson. From the website below drug abuse, violence, and oppression are among the most common cases where people mess up their life and are now considered in the lower class.

Supporting Evidence: Why is there poverty? (www.agjohnson.us)
adairj18(9) Clarified
1 point

I agree, there was a video done a while ago. A man gave money to a homeless man and he secretly followed him and saw him buying liquor from a store. Instead, he could've bought food.

1 point

Yes, I believe the US has a class system that has 4 parts. The upper class for example Beyoncé, the upper middle class, the lower middle class, and the lower class like homeless people or those in poverty. I don't have an opinion whether there should be one or not, but i do believe if you work hard then you deserve more.

1 point

Yes, I think the U.S. has a class system. Here it's like a system in old ages where there were the peasants, nobles, knights and kings. Now, in modern culture the people who earn $200,000 per year are the kings. This is about 3% of America's population. The knights earn about $75,000 per year, which is about 40% of America's population. The nobles are the middle low class which earn 27% $19,000 per year. The bottom class 30% are the peasants and earn $7,000 per year

1 point

Yes, most definitely the U.S. has a class system, especially when it comes down to poverty you hear the upper/rich class, the middle class, and the lower/poor class.

1 point

Yes, most definitely the U.S. has a class system, especially when it comes down to poverty you hear the upper/rich class, the upper middle class, and the lower/poor class. Honestly, our federal government should do something serious to fix this problem. It's not fair to the poor individuals on the street that fight everyday just to get one more second to live on this earth. On the other hand, we treat the greedy high upper class with much love and support. Millions VS. 20 dollars, seriously we need to fix this! Overall, I believe this is a great issue that needs to be resolved become we're causing the deaths of many innocent people!

1 point

The class system also affects America as a whole; not everyone has equal opportunities. Children from rich families will be well supported and their talents will be harnessed. They could become revolutionary figures. Children from low income families will not have an opportunity to learn new skills and develop their talents. As a result, they may find it difficult to climb the social ladder. While there are people who can fulfill this “rags to riches” dream, few succeed and go on to higher positions. This puts the U.S. at a disadvantage, as so much potential and talent is wasted. I think that America should continue to find ways to educate young people from kindergarten to college; this can really help benefit not only America but citizens as well.

1 point

High income earners likely are substantially educated, have high-status occupations, and maintain powerful social networks.

According to the "American Dream," American society is meritocratic and class is achievement-based. In other words, one's membership in a particular social class is based on educational and career accomplishments.

Source: Boundless. “The Class Structure in the U.S..” Boundless Sociology.

1 point

Income is often closely aligned with other indicators of status; for example, those with high incomes likely have substantial education, high status occupations, and powerful social networks.

1 point

Yes, i believe in this third-world country, there are many classes ranking from high to low. It even shows when we elect presidents for example. Most presidents in the past have came from a wealthy family. For example, Obama came from a wealthy family as well as many past presidents. Then there are people from the lower class, the homeless or poor people. If we didn't have a class system, we would all be equal or same. Which obviously we aren't.

Supporting Evidence: America's Class System (www.usatoday.com)